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- 6 days ago36 min
The DTC math most founders refuse to do (until it's too late) | Suze Dowling @ Pattern Brands
Suze Dowling has seen the inside of more DTC brands than almost anyone. As co-founder of Pattern Brands, a multi-brand home goods portfolio she's been building since 2018, she doesn't just run one brand. She runs five at once on a shared services team, which means she watches the same mistakes play out across categories, price points, and growth stages, over and over again.The biggest one: founders who scale before the math works.In this episode of Unfinished Business, Alex and Lee sit down with Suze for one of the most honest DTC conversations they've had. She talks about what she actually looks for when acquiring a brand, why she's shut down companies that were still profitable, and why the DTC equation most founders ignore is the thing that determines whether your brand survives.In this episode:- The DTC math equation Suze uses to diagnose any brand: revenue = AOV x conversion x sessions, and why most founders try to scale before all three are working- Why profitability was Pattern's non-negotiable when the rest of the industry was chasing growth at all costs- How she decided to shut down profitable brands, and why she calls it opportunity cost, not failure- The thing founders lie to themselves about most: product-market fit- What running five brands simultaneously teaches you that one brand never could- Why she still calls five customers herself every week, by phone- How tariffs forced the hard calls she already knew she had to make- Pattern's global team structure and how she got lean before lean was the obvious move- Where she stands on AI right now, and why not using it is "truly petrifying" to herSuze is the kind of operator who has made the expensive mistakes, learned from them, and built a system around never making them again. If you're building a DTC brand right now and you're not sure whether your math is actually working, this one is for you.
- Apr 14, 202631 min
Inside Hulken: How Our CBO Built a $50M Community-Led Luxury Brand
We turned the mic around. For the first time on Unfinished Business, Alex and Lee are interviewing someone from inside Hulken, their own Chief Brand Officer.Tara Seruya has been working with Alex and Lee for over a decade. They first met at Ivy, their first company together. When Hulken came along, Tara came with it. She's the person behind every brand decision that resonates: the Supreme collab, the Oscars, the community of makeup artists, hairstylists, and set designers who carry Hulken everywhere and post about it without being asked.In this episode, Alex and Lee ask her everything. The things that worked. The things that surprised them. The expensive editorial shoots that didn't land. The authentic, messy UGC that outperforms everything.We covered:→ What luxury actually means: Hulken is "conceptually not luxurious." But it makes you feel unstoppable.→ The organic-first paid strategy: Hulken never runs content on paid until it proves itself organically.→ Obsession over content skills: Hulken find superfans who were already carrying the bag every single day and ask them to tell their story. Tara explains why that distinction changes everything→ The creative community told us where to go: Makeup artists, hairstylists, prop stylists, and set designers were using Hulken organically before there was a brand strategy around it.→ Solving a real problem: Alex on why none of the brand, the collabs, or the cultural moments would have mattered if the product wasn't genuinely solving a daily problem for real people.→ Brand content vs. paid content: How Hulken keeps these lanes intentionally separate→ Branding advice. In ASMR. Lee asked. Tara delivered.If you want to understand how a product goes from utilitarian rolling bag to cultural icon (without losing itself along the way) this is the blueprint.Listen and subscribe everywhere you get your podcasts!
- Apr 7, 202621 min
How We Built a $50M Consumer Brand with 7 People
Seven people. $50 million in annual revenue. One brand that somehow manages to feel like it's everywhere.If you've ever wondered how Hulken actually works (the operating model, the org chart, the tools, the strategy), this is the episode.This week on Unfinished Business, there's no guest. It's just Alex Schinasi and Lee Rotenberg, co-founders of Hulken and co-hosts of this show, getting into the questions they get asked most often: How do you run a brand this size with a team this small? How do you think about brand vs. growth? What does AI actually look like in your day-to-day? And what's actually coming next?Alex and Lee built Hulken from scratch into one of the most recognizable product brands in the DTC space: a rolling bag that started as a practical solution and became a cult object. They did it with a lean team, a very deliberate agency model, and a relentless focus on what actually moves the needle.In this episode:→ The $50M with 7 people model: Why Hulken runs on a lean in-house team and a carefully chosen agency network→ Alex's recent aha moment: growth and brand have completely different north stars, and treating them as the same function quietly dilutes both. Here's what changes when you split them.→ Building AI systems at Hulken: The first AI agent they're building internally→ The Claude Cowork morning routine: Alex's exact setup→ Why the fact that Hulken isn't a Hermès bag is one of its biggest brand advantages→ Hiring AI agents instead of humans: Why the question isn't just "should we hire?" but "should this role be a human?"→ What's coming next: Collabs, new products, and a few things they can barely talk about yetThis is the most behind-the-scenes episode they've done. If you're a founder, a builder, or someone who's been following Hulken and wondered how the machine runs, this one is for you.New episodes of Unfinished Business drop every week. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and follow along at @unfinishedbizpodcast.
- Mar 31, 202633 min
How Dylan Munro Invented a New $130M DTC Category and Built a Factory to Protect It
They cooked dog food in a rented kitchen in Queens. Their friends thought they were insane. That was 2018.Today, Spot & Tango is a 100% direct-to-consumer, subscription dog food company doing $120-130M in revenue and growing 60% year over year. This is all with zero retail shelves, 95% subscription, and a $35M factory they built themselves to protect a category they invented.Dylan Munro is the co-founder and COO of Spot & Tango. Before this, he was at McKinsey, diligencing DTC brands for private equity firms. He grew up in Canada in an entrepreneurial family and always knew he wanted to build something of his own. When his co-founder Russell was cooking human-grade dog food in a studio apartment on the Upper East Side and neighbors kept asking to buy it, Dylan was introduced at exactly the right moment. They quit their jobs, rented an incubator kitchen in Queens, and started making dog food by hand.In 2020, they launched UnKibble: a freeze-dried, human-grade dog food that was genuinely unlike anything on the market. They called the category "fresh dry." No one else was doing it. They sold through four months of inventory in four days.That was the signal. They raised money, built a $35M factory in Allentown, Pennsylvania, brought manufacturing in-house, added over 20 points of margin, and went profitable in late 2023. They've been growing double-digits every year since.On this episode of Unfinished Business, Alex and Lee sit down with Dylan for one of the most practically dense DTC conversations they've had, covering the real mechanics of how Spot & Tango actually scaled.In this episode:- The website quiz that added 10-15 questions between a visitor and checkout and doubled conversion while cutting CAC in half (yes, more friction = better results)- How they scaled creative throughput 10-20x: hundreds of pieces a month, 70% UGC, a systematic outreach process to source creators, and a full AB testing operation on Meta- Why Dylan calls himself and his co-founder "golden retrievers" and how the discipline of saying no built a $130M business- The decision to spend $35M on a factory (and exactly why it was the right call)- The "fresh dry" category: what it is, why nobody else was doing it, and why owning the manufacturing was the only way to own the category- How Spot & Tango uses TikTok- The D2C vs retail debate they have all the time and where that conversation is right now- Pop Gum: the dental chew they launched 7 months ago that's already at $10M+ ARRDylan is the kind of operator who does the unsexy work, thinks clearly about the fundamentals, and has the receipts. If you're building a DTC brand and trying to figure out how to actually scale efficiently, this episode is for you.
- Mar 24, 202630 min
The Bootstrapped DTC Founder's Playbook with Ben Cogan of Beanstalk
The DTC era of "raise money first, ask questions later" is over. And Ben Cogan saw it coming.Ben is the co-founder of Hubble Contacts, one of the original DTC brands, which grew to $100M+ in revenue and earned him a spot on Forbes 30 Under 30. He then founded Mockingbird Strollers (now in Target), Agora (a DTC acquisition firm with $120M raised and $200M+ across its portfolio), and Beanstalk, the invite-only DTC conference that's become one of the most sought-after gatherings in the space. Before all of that, he was at Boston Consulting Group and got his first taste of early-stage DTC at Harry's in 2014.In this episode, Ben gives Alex and Lee a candid masterclass on what it actually takes to build (and keep building) a profitable DTC brand. He's seen the boom. He's seen the bust. And the thread running through every brand that's made it? Profitability from day one.We covered:→ The VC-backed DTC reckoning: Companies that went public in 2021 are down 80–90%. Meanwhile, the bootstrapped brands that grew on profitability and cash flow are the ones getting acquired at the best multiples. The playbook has flipped and founders need to know it.→ Why 80% of retail is still offline: Even outside of grocery. Ben breaks down why meeting your customers in stores isn't just a revenue play… it makes your existing digital spend more efficient by giving buyers one more touchpoint to actually convert.→ The $20–25M omnichannel threshold: Ben's rule of thumb for when going online-only stops working and what happens to your incremental Meta spend when you cross it without a retail presence.→ Attribution in an omnichannel world: Triple Whale and Northbeam are useful, but Ben's most impactful attribution strategy is also the simplest: geo tests. Pull your Meta spend in specific states and watch how your offline (Target) numbers respond.→ Bootstrapped = the best acquirable business: Why Agora specifically looks for profitable, bootstrapped companies and why "you can't hide if you're bootstrapped" is the ultimate test of product-market fit.→ How to think about an exit: When does it make sense to sell? What do strategic acquirers actually want? Ben breaks down what the best acquisitions have in common and what role scale, omnichannel presence, and founder involvement play in making a deal work.→ Playing defense on dupes: Alex and Lee get real about the copycats coming for Hulken and Ben explains the only answer that actually works: keep building the brand the dupes literally cannot replicate.→ Beanstalk: What Ben built, why it's invite-only, and what he hopes the DTC community gets out of showing up.This is the episode for founders who are building profitable businesses the hard way without a safety net, without VC subsidies, and without anywhere to hide. And who want to know exactly where that path leads.
- Mar 17, 202637 min
Why Most DTC Brands Get Retail Wrong (and How to Fix It) with Nate Rosen @ Express Checkout
He's seen the balance sheets behind the brands your feed tells you are crushing it. And what he's found? The gap between the press release and the spreadsheet is bigger than you think.Nate Rosen is the co-founder of Express Checkout: the media company covering CPG, consumer brands, and retail with the kind of depth and honesty the industry doesn't always love. With a twice-weekly Substack newsletter, a weekly podcast, and an Instagram account he grew to 36k followers in under three months, Nate has built one of the most trusted independent voices in the consumer brand world.Before Express Checkout, he spent years inside CPG. He was watching founders navigate cash flow crises while posting glossy Erewhon launch announcements, watching brands land major retailers without the sell-through infrastructure to support it, and learning what actually separates the brands that compound from the ones that flame out quietly.On this episode of Unfinished Business, Alex and Lee sit down with Nate for one of the most grounded, practical conversations we've had yet.In this episode:- Why you cannot compare yourself to other brands and why doing so is holding you back (the RXBAR lesson is one you'll remember)- D2C vs. retail packaging: why your best-converting DTC packaging will probably fail on shelf- The "three-second rule" that separates retail-winning brands from the ones that get passed by- When a DTC brand is actually ready to go retail and the specific signals Nate looks for before recommending the jump- Why your influencer strategy needs to match your distribution strategy (and the expensive mistake brands keep making)- How Siete, Liquid Death, and OLLY built brand + distribution strategies that compound and what you can take from each- How he grew @expresscheckout to 36,000 Instagram followers in three monthsNate is the kind of person who will give you the real answer even when it's not the one you were hoping for. And in a world where so much of the CPG conversation is performative, that's exactly what this industry needs more of.If you're a founder building a consumer brand, whether you're DTC-only, thinking about retail, or already in stores, this episode is for you.
- Mar 10, 202640 min
How to Build a DTC Brand That Actually Lasts with Brooke Yoakam
Most marketing decisions aren't driven by strategy. They're driven by ego.That's the honest (and slightly uncomfortable) truth that Brooke Yoakam, founder of AvidAI and the brand analyst behind @thebrandblueprint_, dropped on this week's Unfinished Business. And she's not wrong.Brooke has been an entrepreneur since she was 13. She built GiftPocket, a customer acquisition platform with 300+ brand partnerships (including Chipotle, ASOS, and Nasty Gal). She then founded AvidAI, an AI-powered platform that helps Shopify brands unlock retention insights and streamline acquisition. She went through Techstars Boulder in 2022. And somewhere along the way, she started an Instagram account @thebrandblueprint_ just as a creative outlet. Now she has 100,000+ followers who tune in to watch her break down the why behind every brand move.In this episode, Brooke gives Alex and Lee a masterclass in how to think about brand building from the inside out, the ego-driven marketing decisions that quietly kill brands, the real meaning of ROI (and why most people get the timing wrong), and the framework she uses to help brands stop guessing and start measuring.We covered:→ Making your product habitual: How to position your product as a need, not a want, and use data to time your retargeting perfectly (hint: if you're hitting someone at the 30-day mark and they still have half a bottle, you're just burning money)→ The "why" behind great brand decisions: What the BEIS car wash pop-up actually revealed about crisis management and brand narrative control→ Super Bowl ads & opportunity cost: Why a $10M Super Bowl commercial might be your worst $10M investment, and what you could do instead→ ROI needs time: The Ole Henriksen/Sunni Lee story, Nello at Coachella, and why the brands that pull the plug too early never see the return→ Collabs done right (and very wrong): Why "Target collabs is where brands go to die," and how to find the right brand partner without diluting your equity→ Data-driven content: The 30-day/30-idea testing framework, A-B hook testing, and how to use ManyChat UTM links to actually track sales back to specific posts→ Going viral ≠ making sales: The brand that got 40M views and zero sales, and what went wrong→ What actually makes a brand premium: Hint: it's not the price tag. It's whether your customers pay full price every time.→ TikTok Shop: Why it works for some brands and quietly damages others (and what Hulken should think about before jumping in)→ Live shopping, packaging, guerrilla marketing: Brooke's live consultation on what she'd do for Hulken if she were on the teamThis is one of those episodes you're going to want to send to your whole team if you want to learn the best tactics and strategies for brand building in 2026.
- Mar 3, 202645 min
Why the Best DTC Brands Build Slow (with Steph Hon @ Cadence)
She spent two years building one product. Went through 207 prototypes. Filed 4 patents. Heard 2,500 nos from investors. And now has 200 of them.That's Steph Hon, founder and CEO of Cadence: the modular, magnetic, TSA-compliant capsule system that's redefining how people carry their routines on the go. Made with recycled ocean plastics. Built with a philosophy that hasn't wavered since day one: don't rush. Don't compromise. Get it right.Before building one of the most innovative product brands in the DTC space, Steph was a ballet dancer, then a film director, then a sports marketer. None of which is a traditional path to founding a CPG company. But every chapter built something she'd eventually use: a heightened physical awareness of how people interact with their products, where friction lives, and how design can make everyday life genuinely easier.On this episode of Unfinished Business, Alex and Lee sit down with Steph for a conversation about what it actually takes to invent a new category.In this episode:- Why "we don't rush product" is the most controversial thing about Cadence and why they don't care- How Steph went from cold-messaging angel investors on LinkedIn to 200 investors (after 2,500 nos)- What it means to build a product that only truly "clicks" once it's in your hands and how you sell that DTC- How her background as a ballet dancer and filmmaker shaped how she designs product- The kombucha meeting that changed how she thought about fundraising entirely- How she's thinking about retail expansion, DTC growth, and Amazon strategy in 2025- Building a loyal, long-term team when you can't afford to pay anyone yetSteph is the kind of founder who doesn't take shortcuts when no one's looking.If you're a founder building something genuinely new, or fighting the urge to ship before it's ready, this episode is for you.
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About Unfinished Business
👋 We're Alex and Lee, serial entrepreneurs and multi-exit founders. Our journey has made us magnets for the challenges ambitious women face in career, family, and personal fulfillment.We're launching a platform for honest discussions about conscious entrepreneurship, career growth, and holistic success. We'll explore topics like mastering self-promotion authentically, transforming imposter syndrome into career catalysts, balancing work, family, and well-being, innovative strategies for entrepreneurial success, and much more.
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