
There’s a particular kind of pressure that creeps in when we start measuring our lives—where we thought we’d be by now, who we imagined we’d become, how things were supposed to feel. The instinct is to fix it. Optimize it. Get moving. But what if the invitation is something else? Kate Bowler sits down with writer and speaker Suleika Jaouad (Between Two Kingdoms, The Book of Alchemy) for a conversation about living inside unresolved questions—especially the ones that ache. Together, they talk about ambition and exhaustion, chronic illness and uncertainty, and the quiet shifts that happen when nothing seems to change. They explore the tension between momentum and meaning, the limits of self-improvement, and what it looks like to keep going without pretending everything is fixable. SHOW NOTES Suleika Jaouad’s Isolation Journals (Substack) Between Two Kingdoms — Suleika Jaouad The Book of Alchemy — Suleika Jaouad Tour dates & tickets: katebowler.com/joyfulanyway Watch the live conversation on YouTube Join Kate Bowler on Substack for the season of Lent: katebowler.substack.com See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
AI Summary coming soon
Sign up to get notified when the full AI-powered summary is ready.
Free forever for up to 3 podcasts. No credit card required.

Doubt, Depth, and the Future of Belief with Tomáš Halík

How to Love the World Anyway with Nadia Bolz-Weber and Sarah Bessey

Joy, Absurdity, and the Weird Ways We Survive with Rhett McLaughlin and Jenny Lawson

Joyful Anyway (Yes, Even Now)
Free AI-powered recaps of Everything Happens with Kate Bowler and your other favorite podcasts, delivered to your inbox.
Free forever for up to 3 podcasts. No credit card required.