From Legal Ops to Business Ops: Mark Allen on AI, Career Growth and the Future of the Function

Hosted by David Cowen | Careers and the Business of Law David Cowen sits down with Mark Allen, Director of Legal Operations and Strategy at Zillow Group - a title that is itself a signal of where the legal ops function is heading. Before Zillow, Mark ran legal operations at Netflix and Activision Blizzard, and has sat on the vendor side at Brightflag and CloudCourt. He's also a newly seated CLOC board member. This conversation covers career advocacy, the vendor-buyer relationship, and why legal ops is quietly becoming one of the best business training grounds in any industry. WHY THIS MATTERS? Legal operations is no longer just a support function - it's becoming the operating engine of the modern legal department. If you're in legal ops today and not thinking about AI, business strategy, and executive influence, this episode is your roadmap. KEY TAKEAWAYS Titles follow impact, not the other way around. Show the work first, then have the conversation. Legal ops is the COO role for a legal department - tech, finance, project management, people, and strategy all in one. Be clear about your intentions with your manager. Doing the work silently is not enough - say it once, clearly. If your leader never sees your value after repeated attempts, it's time to move on. Know your worth. Introverts may actually have an edge - action speaks louder than talk tracks. Vendors: skip the 30-minute sales deck. Show the tool. Buyers know what they need within 15 minutes. Make friends with vendors even when you're not buying. It's a knowledge exchange, not just a sales call. Finance and HR are your fastest path to the executive table internally. Legal ops professionals are being asked to change an operating model that has existed for hundreds of years. An AI-first mindset is no longer optional. Legal ops is essentially a small business degree - creativity, risk-taking, and cross-functional thinking built in. PEOPLE MENTIONED David Cowen — Host Mark Allen — Director of Legal Operations and Strategy, Zillow Group; CLOC Board Member Jen McCarron — Former President of CLOC; Netflix colleague of Mark's Mary O'Carroll — Legal ops trailblazer Jason Barnwell — Legal ops trailblazer Rajan Gupta, Ryan Black, Leo Murgel, Stacey Lettie - Legal ops market leaders referenced Olivia Dean — Artist; Mark's exit song pick ("Nice to Each Other") COMPANIES & ORGANIZATIONS MENTIONED Zillow Group — Mark's current company Netflix, Activision Blizzard — Previous buyer-side roles Brightflag, CloudCourt — Mark's vendor-side experience CLOC — Legal ops community; CLOC Core 12 referenced; CLOC.org Solid, Running Legal Like a Business, Legal Week, ILTA — Legal ops education and community events 🎧 Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. Share this episode and take your career from now to next! 💡To learn more about the future of legal innovation, visit https://solid.legal/podcasts/ Never eat alone!